Socalism: Do we need it?

[Bankai]

[zapnosis]

OK here we go...

There are quite a few points that I would argue here, but the accuracy or otherwise of individual points is not really the difference between my views and those expressed.

You write almost entirely about the individual, and no doubt the individual is often the motivation for our actions. I believe that nothing can save us from self-interest... it is built in to the very structure of life and to remove it would be to change everything that we are and have been.

But, for the individual who goes from sweeping the street to being a millionaire, what is their money worth? It is worth a share of what the economy produces. Dollars and Euros do not produce, or design, or create. People do those things. Human ability is the resource that makes all other resources useful. And this is just the tip of the iceberg.

How did we get this far? When did we realise that we didn't have to find our own food, heat ourselves, shelter ourselves and so on? By forming a community, a society, by understanding the needs that we have in common and working together, human beings prospered. We specialised, allowing each individual to work to their advantage, allowing individuals to learn, to pass on knowledge, to become more efficient and then to free up time for study.

Everything that we have learnt, everything that we have a achieved, is a product of society. Without society, Newton, Einstein and whoever else you fancy would have been too busy chopping wood for the fire and growing potatoes to apply, develop and record their understandings. Without the security and support of a community, all individual ability is wasted.

Capitalism too cannot work without the support of a community. People seem to think that capitalism alone is stable, but it is not. Without a community, capitalism would become a system based on conflict where those with the strongest weapons would steal from and repress the weak. Capitalism requires a stable society to be worth anything and it will benefit from that society being healthy, educated and provided for.

So if our first thoughts are for our own gain, our second thoughts must be for our community. Capitalism has it's place, but it is not perfect and it is certainly not The Answer. Investment in the community is an investment in human beings, that is what has got us this far and that is what will secure our future... if anything can.

ZAP

[sarnoga]

[VeryGnawty]

Economy is a fabrication of the human mind. There is no capitalism or socialism. There is only supply and demand. The only reason government exists to begin with is because there was a demand for it. Someone had a bright idea, and supplied it.

Capitalism is only better than socialism if there is a higher demand for capitalism.

[sarnoga]

[VeryGnawty]

[Thrideye]

I don't think we need socialism, but we cannot stay where we are now. Socialism scares me because look back to WWII when America gave the most popular socialist Eugenics, and see what came from that (Holocaust).

Our current administration is weakening thanks to the last sixteen years of problems that neither the republicans nor democrats seemed to want to fix, they have begun worrying over our image to much to protect this countries future.

[livelonger8]

[VeryGnawty]

[livelonger8]

[phryne]

No -ism will ever replace the role of human intelligence.

[bandler]

[oraprog]

Do we "need" socialism? No, absolutely not. Nor do we "need" capitalism.

That being said - my belief is that systems which allow the individual to pursue their own desires are the best systems.

Socialism requires that the individual submit to what is available - all people share in the deprivation.

Capitalism affords the opportunity for individuals to make choices of balancing what they want against what is available.

Therefore, capitalism is the system which promotes more individual happiness.

[radar]

Got a nice blend of both out here in Australia.

Citizens are able to earn $$$ and chase their personal dreams while still protecting the vulnerable in our society with free healthcare, unemployment benefits, pensions and low cost education.

I think the extremes of both systems are bad.
There are no winners without losers.
Capitalism lets you win while society loses.
Socialism lets society win while you let your dreams and goals pass.

Get the balance right and you have the makings of a utopia.

[sarnoga]

[quote="radar"]Get the balance right and you have the makings of a utopia./quote]

One person's utopia is another's hell.

[radar]

*Grins* Never said my balance was for everyone.. Find your own balance..