Opinions/Thoughts on files meant to change sexual preference

[zjohns916]

I'm just really curious about it. I know that there is CFG/CFS and that people have used it on here to make changes. Why isn't there more discussion about it? I think that its extraordinarily interesting that some people have claimed to change their preference. Let me know if anyone has experience with these files or thoughts on them. I'm in the midst of Curse forced Straight right now and have no one to talk to about my little experiment haha.

[Route42]

There's a couple of major threads for CFG under the Success Stories forum.

Here's the current one for CFS:
http://www.warpmymind.com/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=8976

[Endo]

It all depends. Personally, I always thought I was purely straight. I've slowly become bi, then pan-sexual. I think it's easier to expand your choices, but I created a file that makes the listener aroused only by femdom (and later reported that maledom now disgusts the user). So it's definitely possible to shrink your tastes as well.

[Alien4420]

Forced Gay made me gay. It's now been over four years, a gradual process in part because I didn't want all of the effects of the file (loss of attraction to women) and tried to fight it. I've been listening again lately and changes continue to occur.

My sense of this is that sexual orientation is a combination of nature and nurture. Twin studies strongly suggest this -- if one twin is gay, an identical twin is more likely than a fraternal twin to be gay as well. But still only about 50%, which is much higher than random but suggests that half of what affects orientation is experiential.

The thing is, outside of the few of us on these groups, the discussion of orientation seems to be essentially dogmatic, with anti-gay fundamentalists on one side pretending that sexual orientation is merely a choice, and more liberal people on the other claiming that it's something you're born with and can never be changed. But if you look at the evidence, whether the twin studies or the societies that have practiced and sanctioned homosexuality or the work of psychiatrists like Anna Freud who were able to change sexual orientation, you find that sexual orientation is more complex and more mutable than most understand.

I think the problem from the perspective of the LGBT community and those who are sympathetic is that religious extremists try to bully gay kids into being straight, and subject them to all sorts of harmful reprogramming efforts to do so. And these can apparently cause a great deal of emotional damage, because, I suspect, they're being done for the wrong reason to kids who don't really want it, or who want it for the wrong reason (social pressure or the belief that they're going to go to hell).

So with both sides wanting to fight for their ideas, each wants to choose a position that suits their agenda and the whole issue gets simplified and mythologized and 99% of the public believes one side or the other. And psychology isn't immune from these social pressures -- psychologists move from the unscientific proposition (rejected by Freud) that psychology is an illness, to the equally unscientific position that all attempts to change sexual orientation are unethical. What gets lost as so often is the truth, and the attempt to understand the more complex reality, in which nature and nurture interact in ways that we still don't understand.

[rigsby]

[danny1988]

[Alien4420]

[danny1988]

[Alien4420]

[lew897]

Behaving a certain way by hypnosis alone like gay or straight is defiantly interesting as it confirms the idea that people can be trained into doing anything. But metacognition I presume is what people need when going into any. Its where you think about how you think about stuff. Stepping back seeing the way you think. Without this, people would be more like animals. Not using metacognition when learning something new will ultimately in my opinion leave a person never really use the information given to and keep older misleading information. My own personal experience is that while it has been wild Ive been able to become bi when ever I want. Why waste the beauty of women and the muscles of men? lol. This is from my own experience and what Ive learned from books on the mind. The mind is so expansive it literally changes structure with contact from different forms of stimuli.

[lew897]

Basically what Im referring to is using MRIs to confirm or deny how the brain works. Magnetic Residue Image basically maps out the brain, not the mind but the physical structure of the brain. With this knowledge of the brains structure we can hypothesize the function of the mind. Usually, doing one activity flares up one sector of the brain while leaving the others completely alone. Hypnosis in general can affect the entire brain at once and allows for the structure to adapt to the new stimuli and the function.

With all this technology at our finger tips and when people don't use it, I know why they still believe that their own experience with hypnosis settles the debate. Im not saying people are dumb, its just that misconceptions will always interfere with new knowledge. Hypnosis being one since it promises a lot, but going against social norms puts stress on the subconscious to manifest easy effortless changes.

[Ryan83]

I guess I will know for sure if this stuff works soon enough. I'm in talks with a hypnotist to undo CFG once and for all. If I can get back to who I was (God willing, there is no other acceptable option) then I'll know for sure it was the hypnosis that did this.

[Endo]

Ryan, if it was hypnosis, then being totally straight wasn't you. You have to be willing to undergo the change, and usually it takes a lot of work to change into something you don't relate somehow to. Also, what's the situation? Is there family pressure to undo your "gayness"? Religious pressure?

[Ryan83]

There's no family or religious pressure. I want to get back to who I was before this file. I will never be happy until that's done.

[WME3]

If you're looking for an answer to find yourself,
A good place to start is where you came to the conclusion you had to go back.

What did the realization stem from?

[ftslave67]

Agree pretty much completely with the wisdom of Alien4420 & Rigsby. With the caveat that (in my opinion) if the conscious or especially the subconscious mind doesn't want to change, it may not be possible. There's a lot of anecdotal evidence that "reparative therapy" (what the fundies call a "CFS" transformation") tends not to work. Guys would go straight for a while, but end up coming back to the gay. I don't think it's just political that the gay population disdains that sort of thing. It can be harmful to young, impressionable minds.

[ftslave67]

Agree pretty much completely with the wisdom of Alien4420 & Rigsby. With the caveat that (in my opinion) if the conscious or especially the subconscious mind doesn't want to change, it may not be possible. There's a lot of anecdotal evidence that "reparative therapy" (what the fundies call a "CFS" transformation") tends not to work. Guys would go straight for a while, but end up coming back to the gay. I don't think it's just political that the gay population disdains that sort of thing. It can be harmful to young, impressionable minds.

[lew897]

Im confused now, are we talking about CFS on this site or other peoples beliefs. Like the church, the government, the radicalists, who exactly are we talking about? Or is it in general with no details? Because with no details, its pretty easy to say yep your pretty much what your born. Are we talking dna, xx, xy, xxy, hormones, or what they think they are in their thoughts. Because hormones can be completely ignored by disorders so a xy can look female because of his body doesn't take testosterone, so hes gay if he likes men? Or just hormones that affect the brain and leave a person with a different brain from their body? Or just that a person who is a hermaphidite is gay no matter what. So, all in I really have no clue as to what being gay really is and isn't...

[Alien4420]

[obey_evolution]

My 2 cents. If you are a straight guy and start a conversion to genetic female, the female sex hormone flooding can "change your track" for a while. It might becomes permanent if you successfully change gender, but I'm just guessing. I know it sounds a bit corny, but I think that love overrides sexual preference as IMHO sexuality is a sliding bar more tied to hormone levels than anything else. If hypno training moves the slider by changing hormone levels, perhaps only a genetic change can permanently change your hormone levels (without medication). I'm likely just BSing BTW.[/b]

[Alien4420]

Unlike animals, though, humans don't seem to have a simple link between the sex hormones and sexual orientation. If you give an animal of either sex it will display male rutting behavior, if you give either sex estrogen it will display female sexual behavior. But in human beings, who are always in heat, sexuality works differently and this doesn't occur. Testosterone will make us hornier, more confident, and more aggressive, but it won't make a gay guy straight. Similarly, estrogen reduces the male sex drive and makes a man more feminine -- more emotional, nurturing, apt to cry, etc. But it doesn't turn a guy gay.

Since hypnosis can change orientation, at least some of it is in software. But there's more to the story and it isn't yet understood. One intriguing observation is that some guys how have taken propecia for hair loss or prostate enlargement report that they develop gay impulses. These persist after you stop using propecia. It doesn't seem to turn them gay but it points to hormonally-induced changes that aren't yet understood -- propecia blocks DHT.

I guess I should add that I took it myself for a while and it definitely had lasting effects but they aren't the kind anyone would want so I don't recommend that anyone play with it in an attempt to jigger their sexuality, or for any reason at all.